Birth place of Jesus.

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Postby Digit » Tue Dec 25, 2007 7:01 am

After what my family and I have been through this year Beag we are just happy to see this Christmas together as a family. :D
Gordon Brown, our Prime Minister, is about the same level as Nixon, certain that he's right and that we are all wrong for thinking that he is like Nixon.
Our bid for the Olympics was based on the idea that the whole show would cost about 3 Billion pounds. Then they added the cost of security, then compulsary purchase of properties on site, oh then they remembered that people might actually want to travel to the games, so added a rail link, then they called in 'experts' to make up for their own lack of brains and then hired someone else to do the maths for them at a total of about 6 billion, now we are upto 10 billion and counting.
The design of the main stadium was only finalised a few weeks ago! Most of it is reinforced concrete and I'm waiting for the penny to drop that you don't get fancy shaped concrete beams off the shelf at Walmart.
All this aginst a backdrop of the Police, Prison Officers, and Probation Officers threatening strike action because Brown says he can't afford a 2.5% pay rise whilst Parliament awards itself 10%.
My country is not a happy one this time. :(
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt
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Postby Minimalist » Tue Dec 25, 2007 10:02 am

Of course there is the one exception in 1980, when the US ice hockey team won the gold medal


That was truly amazing because that Russian team was so good that if they had played them 100 times the Russkis would have won 99. No miracle, though. The Russian goalies let in a couple of soft shots that day.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

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Postby Beagle » Tue Dec 25, 2007 10:24 am

No miracle, though.


No way. That was one mother-effin' miracle! And to back me up - all modern media agrees with me. :D
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Postby Digit » Tue Dec 25, 2007 10:49 am

The Lord works in mysterious ways, his wonders to peform!
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt
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Postby Minimalist » Tue Dec 25, 2007 10:58 am

Bad goaltending is never a miracle.....it is actually all too common.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

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Postby Forum Monk » Tue Dec 25, 2007 11:55 am

I know a miracle.

My daughter.
When my wife got pregnant she had an eight pound tumor grew into her uterus. It was internal in the uterus taking the space normally occupied by the fetus. At 8 weeks we were sent to a prenatal specialist in another city who advised abortion. We were devastated but decided to place the baby into the hands of God. The specialist then referred us to another as he did not want to handle it. The second monitored the situation very closely, with three time a week tips to the other city and extended examinations. He gave us about 1 in 300 odds of success. We decided to press on.

We could not obtain a good ultra-sound as the energy was being absorbed by the tumor. We at least had some certainty the baby had the necessary arms and legs and there was a heart beat. We had hope. We could not tell the sex, however. At about 6 months we began a program of twice daily monitoring. My wife had to sleep on one side continuously so gravity would pull the tumor to one side of the uterus giving the baby as much room as possible. At the beginning of the seventh month, the doctor decided if this was going to happen, it was going to happen now! Emergency C-Section was performed and out came a something that was immediately rushed out of the theater. After about 10 minutes they brought me to her. All 3 pounds of her. One side of her head was crushed in, one foot was mangled into misshape. She was alive and the nurses were hopeful, which made me feel better. The tumor was removed with my wife's uterus.

She went through one month of special care and never had a set back. She couldn't eat on her own, she was barely the size of my hand. It was very trying but we prayed and believed. Eventually she grew healthy enough to be released.

Today she is 16, completely healthy, beautiful, no defects, very intelligent, very focused on goals. She is a miracle and we give God the credit. (and the specialist as well!)
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Postby kbs2244 » Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:52 pm

Sometimes it is a combination of faith and technology. Medicine is coming around to the idea that mental state and will power do have something to do with a persons physical state. The old idea was that the body was just a machine, devoiced from the mind.
Was it Thomas Edison that said "The only purpose my body has is to carry around my head?"
That idea is going away.
I am not a follower of his, but I think the Oral Roberts hospital in Tulsa had the start in this idea. Due to who the founder was, the doctors had to agree to the “faith healing” procedures as well as the medical. Sometimes it worked.
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Postby Digit » Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:58 pm

I'll not gainsay you Monk. 8)
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Postby Minimalist » Tue Dec 25, 2007 9:40 pm

It's a great story. I, being an interminable cynic would be inclined to give the doctor top billing over god.

It reminded me of this comment by H. L. Mencken, though.

The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
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Postby Forum Monk » Tue Dec 25, 2007 11:58 pm

Minimalist wrote:It's a great story. I, being an interminable cynic would be inclined to give the doctor top billing over god.


Yeah, I thought so...and the "Miracle on Ice" to bad goal tending. Though both moments were sweet, I tend to agree with you on the hockey miracle.

:wink:
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Postby kbs2244 » Wed Dec 26, 2007 11:33 am

Now that you have got her this far, keep a close eye on her.
She is at the second most dangerous time in her life.
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Postby Minimalist » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:49 pm

Forum Monk wrote:
Minimalist wrote:It's a great story. I, being an interminable cynic would be inclined to give the doctor top billing over god.


Yeah, I thought so...and the "Miracle on Ice" to bad goal tending. Though both moments were sweet, I tend to agree with you on the hockey miracle.

:wink:



I'm positive that there is really no comparison between the two in your eyes!

:D
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
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